Jordan you mentioned VO2 max via Cooper Test/1.5 mi run in Vital 5 to hit that “elite goal target” of 56 for males age 30-45. I’m a terrible runner - I’m closing in on a 7 min 2k row but I struggle to get a 8:30 mile. Just based on that you can guess it’s due to form. Question is - there are rowing VO2 max calculators like VO2max Calculator for Indoor Rowing | Concept2 but they’re flawed - does it matter? Or should I just suck it up and start running to figure out how to run well.
I’m not as familiar with the rowing VO2max calculators, but VO2max is absolutely “mode” dependent. In other words, if you take a runner and you make them test their VO2max on a bike, it’s going to look artificially low.
We offer some VO2max proxies for cycling if that helps. The rowing stuff is probably fine, but I’m just not as familiar with it.
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What are those cycling proxies? I have a bike too
They are listed in the Vital 5 action plan. Did you download it?
I did! I assume you’re basing that on the ACSM cycling guidelines? 4 w/kg is a very competitive (like cat 2 cyclist) sustained level for 20 min, even for someone under 40. That number is likely way higher than the reported 52.5 VO2 max, that math doesn’t check out (a sustained 4 w/kg for 20 min would put you closer to 58-60, which is definitely an elite vo2 max). I believe vo2 max is a much shorter (5-8 min) duration and they generally discount that level even more for the FTP test . I know the asterisk assumes a 5% discount but even then I’d say a 4 w/kg is much harder to hit than say a 6:45 mile time? Maybe I’m wrong? I just read those numbers and I was doing a double take
VO2max tests are usually graded and < 15-minutes. I agree that the cycling targets are higher than the running targets. The issue is harmonizing the data. I haven’t figured out a good to do it with the limitations of the datasets available, but I’m thinking the elite group in 20-39 would be ~ an FTP of 3.08 W/kg or a 20-min field test of 3.24 W/kg. I’ll be updating the chart as soon as I wrap my head around it more fully.
That makes a lot more sense. The math is basically like:
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VO2 max Power (MAP): maximum wattage you can sustain for roughly 5 to 8 minutes.
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20-Minute Power (FTP): This is typically only 85-90% of VO2 power.
As an example, if I’m 175 lbs and did 329 watts for 20 min, VO2 would be closer to 58-60.
Thus if I wanted a 52.5 VO2 max I would only need to hold that 334 watts for about 6 to 8 minutes. Sustaining it for 20 minutes is a significantly harder feat of endurance. There is a book called the Time Crunched Cyclist which has you testing yourself x2 for 8 min (2x8’, 10 min rest in between) to base your training off of. That could be the test - get your average watts for those 2 tests to get your VO2 max?
There have been many tests put forward in cycling (and elsewhere) for how to determine an individual’s max capacity. I’m not aware that the 2 x 8 maps well to vo2max (to the extent that matters), whereas I know the devil I’m dealing with converting FTP to VO2max. The problem was the original data set I used was from mostly competitors. For me, I like the longer tests (i.e. a 20 min time trial) as both a monitoring tool for improvement and as a means to help with exercise prescription.
for cycling, 20m isn’t a bad way to approximate.
Ramp tests have been shown pretty accurate and i feel like it’s a mentally easier test to get done.
Personally, I’ve found the easiest way to get my VO2 high is to cut weight. But i feel better if im carrying more muscle.
Rowers tend to have the lowest VO2max, but the highest VO2 and power. They carry a lot more muscle than runners snd cyclists.