A curiosity if I may be permitted? Given consensus points to differing outcomes between individuals in calorie intakes, what is the highest calorie needs you’ve come across in an atypical person?
By atypical I mean as close to average height and bodyweight with no underlying conditions and no high volumes of activity or exercise that couldn’t explain such high requirements?
I haven’t seen anyone in the demographic you’re referring to whose energy needs raised an eyebrow when objectively measured. I do think a lot of people have issues with reporting energy intake.
I’m not exactly sure what you mean by “given consensus points to differing outcomes between individuals in Calorie intakes”, so I may not be actually addressing your question.
There does seem to be a limit of energy intake/absorption around 3-4-times an individual’s BMR. Some athletes hit this during the Tour de France and similar competitions.
Thank you @Jordan_Feigenbaum
To clarify if you take two people the same height, weight, body composition, gender, etc and subject them to the same activity there’s a lot of studies that show variances between energy needs and nutrient partitioning.
I had just wondered if you’ve ever come across an extreme outlier, eg a 5’10, 175lbs meat and potato lifestyle dude who has to eat like 6000kcal a day to gain size? Compared to another dude of the same attributes who maybe needs 3000kcal at most.
So there is an upper limit on how much permanent weight from calories somebody can gain in a day? Does this work for both muscle and fat gain?
I had just wondered if you’ve ever come across an extreme outlier, eg a 5’10, 175lbs meat and potato lifestyle dude who has to eat like 6000kcal a day to gain size? Compared to another dude of the same attributes who maybe needs 3000kcal at most.
Some people will gain or lose more at a given deficit/surplus in a set period of time, but it’s not clear to what degree adding or removing more energy would even the score.
I have not personally seen anything close to what you describe.
So there is an upper limit on how much permanent weight from calories somebody can gain in a day? Does this work for both muscle and fat gain?
Outside of fluid changes and surgery, an energy surplus (Calories) is the only way people can gain weight (muscle or fat), though I’m not really sure what the question is. Does what work for both muscle and fat gain?
Thank you @Jordan_Feigenbaum what I am asking is based upon your note about BMR x 3-4 being an upper limit on energy absorption, does that mean there is indeed an upper limit of what the body can actively utilise for fat, glycogen and even muscle storage day to day?
I would presume that somebody, assuming they were capable of doing so, would not gain 10lbs of permanent weight in a day if they consumed 35000kcal + Maintenance? Therefore my interpretation is that long term weight gain involves an energy surplus at any level over multiple days and weeks because the body cannot absorb absolutely everything in a short time frame?
We think that may be an absorption limitation of the gut, meaning that more energy doesn’t make it into circulation for the body to use.
1lb of mass isn’t 3500kCal of energy to form, liberate, or otherwise use. Non-fluid/surgery-related weight change is ALWAYS a function of energy balance struck over weeks and months, not days.
I’m really trying to get to the heart of this line of questioning to satisfy your query, but this kind of seems like a moving target. May I ask., what is your exact question and how do you plan on using this information?
I am stuck in a cycle of binge eating post cut and just cannot seem to do things correctly in the manner intended. My goal is muscle gain and I track every day honestly, even binge days to my horror. My 30 day average based on MacroFactor estimate is +300kcal surplus, but I feel fat already.
So assuming in the short term I have been stuck in some binge days and uneven calorie intake, will I actually gain any muscle or is the potency of a binge day so great that I will just gain fat, irrelevant of average?
Feel like just admitting it to the world about how screwed up it all is now.
I see. Thanks for sharing, as I’m sure that’s not easy to talk about.
As far as our previous discourse, I don’t think any of it is really applicable to you. Certainly no actionable items based on that information anyway.
I think the main thing to figure out are your dietary practices, feelings about body comp, locus of control, and so on. I have some concerns regarding tracking food in this context.
As mentioned in this thread, weight change is the result of average intake over weeks and months, not days. Ignoring fluid and GI content-related weight changes, people gain and lose fat and muscle simultaneously in nearly all cases. I do not think energy intake is (or necessarily should be) even per se’.