The LF PB gen 2 instructions say that RPE for single rep sets is gauged slightly differently than multiple rep sets. The subjective exertion seems about the same, but the bar speed varies slightly. I don’t compete, so I can’t gauge to attempts at a meet.
It seems like single rep RPE 7/8 moves slightly faster, closer to 6.5/7.5 multiple rep RPE. RPE 9 seems the same.
Does this sound about right? I assume it’s related to fatigue costs of single rep sets being higher at a given RPE than multi-rep sets.
I think if you tracked bar speed with an instrument (e.g. Tendo unit or similar), you would see SLOWER bar speeds on the single-rep efforts than the final rep of a multi-rep set at the same RPE. That said, a lot of this varies amongst individuals, where some folks really don’t see a big fall off in bar speed until they hit a wall. I may just be projecting here…
While you may not go to a meet to compete in an organized setting, you can put yourself in a competitor’s shoes to help you judge things. Imagine you were trying to maximize the weight you squatted on a given day within 3 attempts. You can imagine how each successive rep should feel in order to go up (from 1st to 2nd attempt and 2nd to 3rd), and how the feedback from each effort would color your jump. I think I’d plan on using that feeling vs bar speed alone to help select a weight.
You’re definitely not projecting on hitting that wall, that definitely happens to me; it’s part of why I’m learning to use bar speed also.
Unfortunately I really don’t know how to get the competition mindset you talk about; my initial thought is that my 1st/2nd attempts would be slightly lower RPE than what I would normally consider an RPE 7/8, and probably stay away from a 9, so that I don’t take away from my max effort.
For example, in the program test day, which is RPE 8 → 9 → 10; I would probably hit a higher max with 7 → 8 → 10, especially on squat/bench, because of that wall. An attempt at RPE 9 would likely make me fail the RPE 10, especially on bench/squat; I might get away with it on deadlift.
It’s not really a competition mindset per se, but rather a gauge of capacity for the day like you were trying to get the most out of yourself. Usually I frame it in jumps: how many weight jumps could you make from here and still be successful.
Obviously, the size of those jumps can vary and are arbitrary, but that’s another anchor I sometimes use: how many more 5-10kg jumps can you make on the squat or deadlift, or 2,5-5kg jumps on the bench press.
7-8-10 is reasonable, so long as your 10 is successful, thus maximizing your performance for the day.
That’s really interesting and makes sense; I’ll think of that when I do the test day.
For the second block, if testing or competing wasn’t a consideration, would the 1@7/1@8 RPE gauging still be the same as you say above, or would it be a more traditional RIR/bar speed gauge? Is it more about fatigue cost in the block, vs testing 1rm?
Well, in prior BBM 1:1 coaching or purchased programs (e.g. PB II 1st gen), there wasn’t any difference between single and multi-set RPE; my understanding was that RPE was always about balancing fatigue costs with intensity to drive strength.
In Low Fatigue PB gen 2, this changes and now RPE for singles doesn’t seem to be about fatigue as much as it’s about figuring out how to warmup to a top single for a 1rm max attempt. Fatigue is still a concern, but it’s different to worry about fatigue for a one day test, vs fatigue that accumulates over weeks/months in a program.
Is this different thinking only for programs that have a 1rm test component, meaning the reason the RPE is calculated differently is that it’s practice towards test day? Or is this being applied to all programs moving forward?
I think I started codifying this ~ 2 years ago, as I was becoming more aware of the disconnect between single- and multi-rep sets with respect to desired effort/exertion levels (from a coaching perspective). In practice, the effort/exertion levels are what I’m trying to guide in order to manage training stress and fatigue. I think if someone is going to go through the effort of doing single-rep sets, they should use the single-rep RPE guidance, as it is a better way to select the weight, and subsquently manage fatigue.
This component is a part of all programs that have singe-rep efforts. I think there is some skill that’s worthwhile in being able to predict maximum performance accurately in order to be more accurate at choosing weights for submaximal efforts. There are a number of ways to do this, e.g. single-rep sets, ascending sets that work to a max, and so on.
That all makes sense. Unfortunately I haven’t done any 1rm testing before, so it’s a little tricky for me to know exactly how to proceed; what I said earlier about likely doing 1@7 → 1@8 → 1@10 is just a guess based on 6 years with RPE and seeing the walls I tend to hit.
I’m starting the first @7 singles this week… Do you have any other advice on how to think about this for someone that’s familiar with RPE but hasn’t tested 1rms before? The nuance around this has been a little tricky to wrap my head around.
FYI thank you for all the advice, as always you guys (and gals) are always super helpful.
I don’t mean to minimize this concern, but I would just encourage you to feel it out. I’m betting you have accidentally overshot and “maxed” or even failed a rep before, so I think you have at least some idea of what a maximal effort feels like. I suspect you have the knowledge to get started, now armed with some nuance, but I wouldn’t overthink it. The reps should be hard, which I’m confident you can gauge without explicitly using RIR.