I apologize if this was answered elsewhere but I am wrapping up the PBII template and before I purchase another template an issue I ran into was the excercise selection.
I have a shoulder issue that rules out OHP, and limits what I can do with incline bench. I also train at a gym that doesn’t have machines, except for a belt squat and a lat pull down.
In PBII there are leg press, leg curl, and a decent amount of OHP type movements. I sub in just more bench variations, squat variations or skip the excercise in question.
I noticed that in the Endurance Template and GSC templates there is a lot of OHP/Incline/Power Clean. The alternate suggestions are just more bench press or deadlift or variations for example. This means I’m jst doing more bench or deadlift and at times, probably not effectively hitting the target muscle groups or accumulating fatigue in ways I probably don’t want. What I mean is if I sub in a paused deadlift for power clean, or a paused bench or close grip bench for OHP I’m either not really hitting the desired muscle group or I’m adding fatigue to my lower back that I didn’t really need to have, or if I reduce the weight to do the OHP so it doesn’t agrivate my shoulder then the rpe/set/rep scheme isn’t enough volume to drive adaptation.
Am I missing something?
Yes, I’m aware there is a shoulder rehab template but I am not in a place where I want to dedicate 13 weeks to a rehab program just hoping that somehow I’ll be able to OHP and not aggrivate my shoulder.
I also hope I don’t have to find a gym that has the machines needed to run these templates.
That is on me, I’m aware but I am hoping that I can get some guidence as to what substitutions are viable and how to modify the rpe/rep/sets to compensate for the additional fatigue in my back from just doing more deadlifts or not being able to do the prescribed or suggested alternate excercises.
Thanks in advance.
Hey Mike,
Thanks for the question. Sounds like you’re looking to get some information on how I think about exercise selection.
The first, is that I think most exercises within a particular movement category (squat, press, pull, hinge) work the same muscle groups more or less. In your example, I think a close grip bench trains the same muscle as OHP. The big difference is the specific movement pattern, i.e. how the muscles are coordinated to contract. Both movements train the muscle groups to create more force, but in different ways. This is why the alternate exercise suggestions are what they are.
The second is trainability, which refers to an individual’s ability to perform the exercise relatively pain free, with acceptable technique, and load it. The loading part is also a bit complicated, as the viable range of intensity, that is, the breadth of weight you can use for an exercise where it is very productive, is WIDE. Practically-speaking, anything north of ~ 65% 1RM is going to be good enough, though less than that still works.
I’m hearing that power cleans and OHP are not on that menu right now. In this context, I would pick a lower body explosive movement to replace power cleans, so paused DL’s aren’t an option. I’d be thinking jump squats, trap bar deadlifts, clean pulls, etc. I think most of these are options in the template you reference. For the OHP, I would try to find a trainable non-flat bench barbell bench option. If it’s a tempo low or high incline bench, that would be great. I also like football bar incline and OHP, landmine presses, arnold presses, and so on. Are there any of these things doable for you?
Happy to help sort out some exercise selection stuff, but hopefully this helps get you started.
Hey thanks for the detailed response!
To answer your question, my shoulders, particularly my right is troublesome enough that even incline bench I’m very limited on intensity, 60% of 1 RM might be pushing it. Even side delt raises I have to be very mindful of my technique. Interestingly, flat bench is not an issue, I suspect because I’ve trained bench so much that my technique is pretty good and so I’m protecting my shoulder.
So when I look at a template and the options are OHP, incline high/low or other variations of incline or OHP I find that I’m out of options so to speak. I end up just doing another flat bench variation
I think sticking with a flat bench variation makes sense if it’s the movement you can perform comfortably and consistently. There’s not much benefit in forcing an exercise that’s always irritating your shoulder just because it’s listed in the template.
That said, if flat bench is the only pressing movement that feels good, it might be worth experimenting with small changes over time rather than trying to jump straight into incline or overhead work. Sometimes adjusting the grip, range of motion, or using dumbbells or a football bar can make a surprising difference.
At the end of the day, training around an injury is usually about finding movements you can progress without making your shoulder worse. Consistency with pain-free training is probably going to pay off more than trying to check every exercise box in a program.
Thanks. It’s not so much about checking boxes and training the muscle groups the prescribed excercise was programmed to train and not just doing more bench or bench variations. The question is also about if the set/rep/intensity as programed should be modified if I sub in a movement that I can perform - if I can do a modified version of the movement but at lower intensity what modifications to the set/rep scheme for a given modification would I make to get a similar stimulus as the original programed movement.
Hey Mike,
60% of 1RM is more than enough load to work with if we add a tempo component and/or increase the reps. I’d be trying something like a 3-0-3 tempo incline bench, as I’d bet you could tolerate that just fine as an entry point.
-Jordan